Click on this Youtube Link for the Official AMA (Audio Version)
Transcriber’s Notes: This is an unofficial transcript made by myself as a community member. It’s easy to recognise Puffin’s voice which sounds like a Mr. Robot kinda guy, but sometimes it took a lot of effort to distinguish between other participants. Pardon me if I might have mistook someone else in the voice recognition. I tried my best using ears filled with brownish gold.
The text is formatted and follows the audio version (about ~97% similarity in content) with slight paraphrasing for brevity / readability.
*29 Nov 2021: Some edits were made after clarifications with the team.
Development Team Participants
DefiAlpha582 – Marketing and Investor Relations, Conference Call Mod
3557(🍔,🍔) – Investor Relations
Foks(🍔,🍔) – Developer
0xPuffin(🍔,🍔) – Developer, also a South Atlantic Bird
mateo633, Moon Man, Hardwood, Mamba, Multivrsal, Freact, Munkka, CryptoBilly, notbettingonfiat, JJH11, Sharkii - Inquirers from the Community
Splatterpope - The Chad who dropped a lot of Discord Nitros.
Hi everyone, this is DefiAlpha582, I help out with Marketing and Investor Relations for ZeroTwOhm. I'm so excited to see all of you guys here today. I'm really looking forward to this conversation - this is the first AMA for ZeroTwOhm, of what we hope to be many more to come.
We see this is a great opportunity to share some of the very exciting things that we're working on, and help clarify our long-term vision which we think is very unique, and offers incredible promise for growth / for this project going forward.
So, with that let's turn it over to questions. Thank you.
Question #1 : What’s different [about Z2O] than any other OHM forks?
(asked by mateo633)
3557(🍔, 🍔) :
To answer your question, we are of the view that we are probably the most differentiated of these newer protocols using this model for issuing bonds to raise treasury assets. I do want to highlight just a few key points around that.
You might have seen we did issue our first medium post just a couple days ago, walking investors through the the vision for ZeroTwOhm which is going to continue to expand as time goes on. The key points there that I want to reiterate are:
First of all, if you look at that medium post, we don't refer to ourselves as a reserve currency and that's because we see opportunity that goes far beyond just mimicking another protocol's model.
We are very knowledgeable of and deeply embedded in the Arbitrum DeFi ecosystem. We're very familiar with gaps on the network, there are opportunities for us to deploy very significant amount of liquidity that we've been raising and continue to raise in ways that are going to be very value additive to our treasury.
We've already deployed capital in several different protocols in ways that are bringing in significant fees and we're continuing to find more.
Over time, we see ourselves [as] the only significant project of our nature on the Arbitrum network.
Arbitrum has very bullish prospects - we're talking about the Nitro upgrade coming out soon, lower fees, we're talking about multiple exchanges like crypto.com and Binance all allowing instant, very low-cost transfers to Arbitrum.
We expect to see a lot of liquidity on this network and we're in a position to take advantage of that, and be the primary source of liquidity powering the expansion of the DEFI ecosystem on Arbitrum.
And again, we are in a place where we don't have a lot of competition for that role, not not in the way that we're doing. So that's a major differentiator and it's one that we are excited about.
The other point is that we're part of a much broader ecosystem of DEFI projects run by Arbi’s Finance. That's an advantage that very few of our peers can tout.
We are really just beginning to get started in leveraging the Arbi's finance platform to support the expansion of Z2O.
Keep an eye on our medium, our blog and on our twitter - you're gonna see some very exciting announcements coming out about - things that we have in the works, things that we're doing and the opportunities for collaboration as we build out kind of this comprehensive DEFI ecosystem as Z2O’s position at the center are enormous.
So actually I mean beyond just being differentiated from other OHM forks, I would suggest dropping [OHM Forks] as a comp and just looking at the underlying model that we've built and that we're expanding because it goes far beyond just replicating another protocol's system.
Question #2 : Are there any plans to launch Z2O on other chains? perhaps Ethereum or Optimism?
(asked by Moon Man)
Think … I'm gonna better answer this question. But yeah so we're not against it but no immediate plans and nothing we want to commit to just yet. But of course we're always doing research and exploring options to create the most value that we can. Foks do you wanna chime in there ?
Yeah, we're very bullish on Arbitrum. Especially, myself and 3557 have been talking about this.
We like the way they're approaching it in terms of how they're trying to get Nitro out, trying to make their product as good as possible, before moving on to business development and marketing - which is a good approach definitely.
That being said the liquidity on Arbitrum is sort of incomparable to Avalanche and Phantom and other chains right now. So, we're sort of actively working on ways to bring liquidity into Arbitrum and to expand on some of the hype that's going on especially regarding Avalanche.
So we see ourselves kind of like the builders on Arbitrum who will sort of forcefully bring people to Arbitrum. Yeah.
Yeah, that's a really awesome point Foks, and I’m glad that you touched on that. The only thing that I'll add because I think Foks covered all the key points that we want to make is, the model that we're describing to you guys here during this AMA, we do believe that long term - this is replicable.
This is a very exciting approach going on to a network like Arbitrum that has a need for the kind of liquidity that we're providing. It's a fast-growing ecosystem on the Arbitrum network and we can play a central role in supporting that.
This isn't something that's a specific plan yet but it's hard not to imagine that some of what we're doing here on Arbitrum would be replicable and very valuable on other chains at a similar stage of development.
That’s just off the top of my head that I want to talk about.
Question #3 : Wen Moon🌙 Can you pop the coin please?
(asked by Hardwood)
0xPuffin(🍔, 🍔) and Foks(🍔, 🍔)
OK Hardwood. Ok Hardwood.
Okay thank you. Thank you for your uh valuable contribution right there. Well uh moving on to the next question [chuckles].
Question #4 : How will the team focus its efforts in increasing its treasury? A healthy treasury will ease the mind of most investors.
(asked by Mamba)
Thank you for your support Mamba by the way. Yeah who wants to take this question?
Just to recap what we've already done:
We did a couple of 🍟French Fries Fridays🍟 which were temporary raised APY to like a million percent or something like that. Just a good way of attracting [bonds].
We've done some analysis and found that at the time we did this two days ago now - our treasury was the same size relative to the network we're on as Snowbank. So, most of our efforts in addition to of course bond discounts and other incentives like that to encourage bonding.
On top of that our main focus is on creating more usable systems on the Arbitrum network like the lending / borrowing we spoke of earlier, so that there's more stuff to do on Arbitrum. So more people will come to Arbitrum and then find Z2O, be able to bond, buy the coin or whatever.
So, we're excited to help grow that ecosystem along with those other legitimate projects and use that to help grow Z2O as the greater Arbitrum ecosystem around it.
*Transcriber’s notes: After the AMA, 0xPuffin(🍔, 🍔) clarified: “btw since I said that about there not being that many things on Arbitrum, I have since learned there’s also a fairly thriving NFT market (forgot name though)”.
I suspect he refers to this project announced by Arbitrum.
Maybe I can also leave some alpha. I’ve had an idea that I've sort of chopped up with the team that I’ve been pretty excited about. It’s sort of the basic concept of OHM itself and a lot of the forks that they're RFV (Risk-Free Value) based.
So how you value the fork or rather how you value the token and its treasury ? It’s based on the RFV inside the treasury, and RFV typically comes from stable coins like MIM, Wrapped Bitcoin and that sort of thing.
Now I think we're in a pretty unique position because as 0xPuffin was saying we're one of the few builders on Arbitrum. And as I mentioned before, Arbitrum kind of has liquidity issues right now like there's no wrapped OHM, ETH liquidity, ETH-DAI liquidity is pretty low and stuff like that.
So an idea I've been pretty excited by recently is shifting the [valuation] model from RFV (Risk-Free Value) backing to LP-based Fee backing.
and what that would mean is taking LPs as bonds so for example we could intake ETH-DAI like an LP and what that would help us do is
A) Increase liquidity on Arbitrum itself.
B) We would help out whatever protocol we're working with in that case. So it could be like wrapped OHM-ETH liquidity on Arbitrum.
C) We would generate a ton of fees for the treasury itself.
That would sort of shift us from the typical RFV model that OHM itself is using and a lot of OHM forks are using and we would move into a more fee based backing. This is especially exciting if you use concentrated liquidity for your LPs.
So for example, for an OHM-ETH LP, we could throw it into active liquidity management for UniV3-LP positions. That would help us to have highly concentrated liquidity generating a fuck ton amount of fees for the treasury.
I think this is a pretty novel concept for ohm fork itself and also it's something that Arbitrum sort of desperately needs right now. So that could be a pretty major move for the treasury and for ZeroTwOhm itself
This is something we're kind of actively pursuing where we're trying to see how it would work right now on Arbitrum because there are some [inaudible] there, but it's something I've been pretty excited about.
Thank you, these are just really awesome ideas. The other thing that I just wanted to briefly share in terms of raising treasury capital.
We've been paying a lot of attention to tokenomics in the OHM forks space and some of the challenges that other OHM forks have run into, with capital raising with respect to this challenge of needing to have high discounts to attract bonders and raise the treasury, but then also running into problems with price - because higher bond discounts disincentivise staking.
There can be a tendency for bonders to dump tokens. Luckily, we have not run into some of the issues that other [OHM forks] had with that - but we're aware of and so we're considering a lot of potential solutions on that front. We think we have some some pretty exciting ideas.
One concept that we've been talking about is a different type of bonding structure whereby people can purchase a bond and instead of just receiving Z2O vested over a five-day period, their Z2O is automatically staked and begins accumulating APY right away.
When the vesting period is over it remains staked and at that point, the bonder is more than welcome to unstake it / sell it / whatever they want to do, but we think that this sort of approach could help eliminate this gap in the structure of tokenomics for a lot of players in this space. Because we want bonders to become long-term holders […and…] we think that it makes sense to let them immediately start enjoying some of the benefits of being a Steaker or accumulating APY.
Starting out with steaked Z20, it's just more user-friendly - there's an ease of simply staying in and continuing to become part of our long-term holders. So that's the concept we're talking about, very excited about it…(continuing below)
Question #5 : How do you expect OHM coming to Arbitrum might affect Z2O?
(asked by Multivrsal)
… I just want to touch on this question that I saw and I think [it] is very important as well. As we know OlympusDAO has talked about bootstrapping liquidity across other platforms. There's a lot of skittishness among investors in [other] projects that have a structure inspired by OlympusDAO.
About how that's going to affect the forks? I do want to address that, I'm sure we'll have some great feedback from other folks on the team as well. But going back to what we've been sharing throughout this call about how differentiated we are and how unique and expansive our business model is - we don't see ourselves as just another OHM fork and for that reason we don't see ourselves as being threatened by OHM.
We're a liquidity provider, we're positioning ourselves to be the central liquidity provider. It's not realistic in my [personal view] on the matter, I don't think it is realistic for even a project like OlympusDAO to have granular network-specific knowledge and focus that a team like ours [have currently as an Arbitrum pure play].
So we see ourselves as retaining that role of central liquidity provider on the Arbitrum ecosystem. We welcome the influx of capital onto Arbitrum from OlympusDAO as they bootstrap onto the network. That's fantastic. There's plenty of opportunities there to partner with them in the future.
We’re really actively excited about that and thinking about different opportunities, reaching out to different developers at other protocols about options.
I do want to highlight that's an opportunity for us, not a risk, because of our differentiation but I’m glad you’ve asked that question.
Cool, I think we could probably just move on to the next question. Thank you for tuning in.
Question #6 : Any plans on changing the Name / Branding of Z2O in the future?
(asked by Munkka)
Another question that I see popping up pretty frequently is on the topic of branding of Z2O. I can just chime in here real quickly at least in terms of the copyright conversation. I think we are exploring multiple avenues we do like the anime branding of Zero Two so I don't think that's going away anytime soon.
However there are a few options that we are exploring such as creating a character that is our intellectual property inspired by Zero Two. That is an option that of course whatever avenue we decide to take down, we would run that by the community and make sure that everyone is on board.
But yeah we are thinking very deeply about that question about branding - making sure that we're listening to the community regarding.
For the community, something we've talked about a little internally but have not taken any concrete steps on yet, is the possibility …of constantly developing our own anime character TV like Zero Two but not Zero Two for branding.
One thing we've looked at is we've done some initial price estimations and inquiries into timelines and things like that and I would be interested to know community's feedback since it already seems pretty split:
on whether we should stay anime themed or not
on taking a small portion of the current treasury assets - it would be less than a hundred thousand dollars and using that money to produce a AAA level full-length anime episode that would be entirely original and play into some of our themes as well as many other themes across.
[Upon hearing this, Discord community explodes with tonnes of messages]
It looks like we're getting a lot of uhh [chuckles] some good interest, I mean many questions. Ummm, I don't know Puffin, what do you think after seeing these? [chuckles again]
Question #7 : We make Hentai now too?? pog
(asked by freact (🍔,🍔))
It sounds like a lot of support. I see someone's asking if we're going to make hentai too? Uh yeah that, maybe not initially
but I can tell them that if they're interested in finding some of that. Recently YEARN found that they just randomly had like 600 million dollars and they're spending that on making a bunch of hentai.
Are they actually?
yeah that's crazy. I remember when they first started the waifus. I knew it was gonna be big.
That's ridiculous! Uh you got a link though? [chuckles]
(Transcriber: Guys, I followed up and also failed to get teh sauce.)
I don’t right now but it's actually, so it's been spoken and partially planned [inaudible ] now.
and again I guess we can take a step back right now to say thank you guys - and all guys and girls, no gender specific - the whole community, thank you so much for being here of course.
Should have started off with that but we appreciate you all taking the time to come and ask questions and support this project because we're super excited about all the things that we're working on and continuing to build.
Question #8 : How are you thinking about fair value of z2o token price as the treasury grows?
(asked by CryptoBilly(🍔,🍔))
I think I can answer this. This is a question that comes up quite a bit with OHM itself. You know, if the treasury is worth 500 million why would the market cap be 4 billion?
I think the simple answer there is that any premium over the intrinsic value of the treasury is a speculation on
the future yield of the protocol, as well as
future utility for the token itself
and I think currently we're thinking about ZeroTwOhm in the exact same way if that makes sense.
yeah that’s a very good way to put it Foks and I'd love to just add a few other thoughts to that as well because I think it's a really important question.
One thing given my role as as investor relations and team member, I thought about this question quite a bit because the way that the information on our dashboard is presented (and we're not the only one that does it this way) where we show a treasury backing that is below the current price can lead to this tendency to ask : “so what's keeping us from from hitting that” and foks kind of really got to the heart of it with his answer.
What i want to add to kind of paint this picture a little more clearly. If you're a z2o Staker, you really are the the owner, if you will, of the treasury. We are raising capital we're doing it for you / for the Steakers.
We're deploying it in all kinds of ways to generate returns, and as long as you're staked, the APY that you're getting is … a stable or growing share of z2o as a whole of its total market capitalization as time goes on. Even if we are continuing to get new z2O out there in order to meet demand - you're the Steaker and all of the emissions for the most part are going to you as if you buy.
So you have this claim now on this treasury that is growing and growing and we're very careful with our bond discounts to make sure that while they reward bond holders, they are not diluting our Steakers. So our hope here is that we're going to continue to raise treasury capital through all the different ways that we've talked about.
We're going to continue to do more things along the lines that we already announced - in terms of staking MIM to Abracadabra for $500,000 dollars per year in returns in the form of spell. We’ll do a lot more like that so this treasury's going to grow anyway.
One thing I want to flag right now we have a governance structure that we think it's a huge advantage over competitors because we're fast and efficient in our decision making. We have a multi-sig but it's our core developer team that oversees it and we make calls we think are going to generate the most value for z2o but we want input from our community.
We care very much about that open dialogue and other governance structures down the line that are, you know, more actively inclusive of the voice of our, stakeholder community, our Steaker community. We we're not closed off to that at all.
So just understand that we're building this treasury for you and you are the owner of it and it's going to get much larger and it's going to generate significant returns.
Yes we have a treasury backing right now per Z2O that is a floor.
But man, we should be trading in a much higher multiple because you really have to think about all the upside of the future capital raising, the future deployment, the growth of our project with Arbitrum.
Those are the valuation metrics that we're paying attention to as we continue to drive this forward, and keep in mind that we're part of a larger ARBIS finance ecosystem so hopefully that's helpful in terms of how to think about valuation.
Question #9 : Please elaborate on how you want to integrate with OHM protocol?
(asked by notbettingonfiat)
Foks flagged this question from notbettingonfiat. Foks do you want a try and answer that?
Yeah so we're actually we're in chats with the OHM team itself, talking about just generally how forks can coexist with OHM itself. OHM is planning to expand to arbitrum avalanche, go multi-chain in the future with their v2 release and I think there's been some worry in the community about how that might affect ZeroTwOhm.
In my opinion, OHM and ZeroTwOhm work in tandem. I don't see OHM itself as a competitor since we're kind of aiming for different things there. Not to mention the fact that we have close to a million, I think over a million of OHM in the treasury itself.
I see forks as being a huge part in the future governance of Olympus especially as they move to launching governance with their v2 release. And then I also wanted to highlight the idea I had before of intaking LP bonds.
So we're calling that Market-Making-as-a-Service, just providing liquidity for everyone on arbitrum itself. I really like this idea because it's kind of like just a massive circle jerk between our team, OHM, and Arbitrum of just providing as much liquidity as possible.
In that way we would be helping OHM itself , we’ll be getting OHM rewards on the LP which is something they're planning to do. So yeah I think because of all those reasons, the OHMies and the darlings are working together trying to play a positive-sum game.
Question #10 : Brief summary of the team's expertise?
(asked by Multivrsal)
It's a fair question, although we are working with some anonymous folks as well as people who have doxxed themselves. Our devs are going to remain anon for all intents and purposes.
We want to do a full introduction of the whole team - maybe in the future so that we can prepare a good summary of all of our expertise, as we all come from different avenues of life. We're all working together, it's the same goal and yeah we have this planned and we want to make sure that we include all the details that are necessary.
Oh uh well I guess I could start. Well my background for my day job is a developer but quite honestly I find that boring a lot of the time. In terms of like crypto stuff, I've been a complete degenerate for a while now.
I've also been a long time Ohmie. I like to study the tokenomics or ponzinomics whatever you wanna call it of Ohm, I think it's like by far the most interesting protocol out right now and I've written some kinds of stuff on twitter.
So yeah that's kind of the basics of my background, at Arbi’s finance I’m a Biz Dev so I'm focusing on partnerships, DAO-to-DAO stuff and growth.
I can continue - In terms of traditional background outside of DEFI and crypto, I am traditionally head of product at an AI company as well as working full-time PM or PM consulting for some other companies. DEFIs become out of my main focus in the past few months so once I [audio dropped for several seconds] … grow the value of everything that we're building here.
Well um, I don't know if anybody else wants to take up an intro up here.
I can do a little intro. I am a Puffin - it’s a small bird from the North Atlantic I believe, and my background is in a lot of things. I've worked in developer roles at various small startups and as well as doing a lot of consulting and sales and entrepreneurship things for several years.
I've worked on everything from DEFI projects like this to physical products as well as as you can see in the chat right now, I also catch fish with my beak.
Um so that that's basically it, I just like doing this kind of thing, I think it's a lot of fun and there's not much I'd rather be doing, than this enjoyable stuff like - who wouldn't want to spend their Saturday afternoon getting a chat with a lot of friends ?
I'm going to be honest I did not know I was working with a bird, but now that I do know I'm even more bullish on this product.
I do gotta say something about our community. This is the funniest community I've definitely found in all my years.
We'll give JJ a chance, I think he's typing right now. Hahaha yo it is the #nsfw channel whatever it says I suppose?
Question #11 : Curious what the back end capabilities for the (fork) code are like, is it total customization potential?
(asked by JJH11)
..So yeah everything can be customized, as you can look on chain you can see on Arbiscan just today - we went and verified the majority of our bond contracts. So you can see that they are basically the same as the old ones at this point, we just added a few more options to make it easier for us to tweak the price and the scale at which the price changes on those bonds.
As I said before, everything about the smart contract is upgradable. Obviously there's some things due to the nature of smart contracts that we can't [change], like currently the z20 treasury can only be owned by one address and that's the multi-sig.
So in the future we've looked at setting up a model where multiple addresses could have different levels of administrative access on it and in the event of that it would require us redeploying the treasury contract but that's that's easy for us to do.
It's just a transition, it would take a very brief period of time so there's nothing that we don't have the capability to upgrade, and if anyone has ideas of custom features they'd like to see or make use of, feel free to drop them in the suggestions channel.
Question #12 : Curious what you guys' sense of Arbitrum is in general, seems super early and not quite sure what makes it stand out from the Dev perspective and the future outlook. (What excites you guys about Arbitrum?)
(asked by JJH11)
Probably someone else can chime in on the Dev perspective but from the team and working relationship perspective, we will share that we do have an open line of communication with the Offchain Labs team and we are working with them to kind of identify gaps and opportunities within their ecosystem. We've got all ears open in terms of what they're thinking and providing feedback from our side as well.
We don't want to share too much of course, the relationship has just started to get started in the past a week or two or so ago. But they are very excited about what we're building and the future that we could build together.
So i think that is something that we want to share. But yeah I don't know if someone else wants to chime in on the dev perspective of Arbitrum.
I can say it's a lot cheaper than deploying stuff on mainnet Ethereum or some of the other side chains and layer 2s I've worked with. It's easy to work with, I haven't had any issues because in the early days, we had some issues with hiccups where things were just paused - but none of that has happened.
I'm excited for the nitro upgrade coming soon which is supposed to make it cheaper than it is now and faster to do everything on Arbitrum.
One of the issues which isn't a real issue - but on the front end we've been having some trouble getting the front end update quick enough with how quick the transactions go through. It's a good problem to have - the network is faster than the front end.
Thanks Puffin. Is Splatterpope dropping a lot of Discord Nitros in chat right now? Thank you. That’s very generous of you. If we have no other comments on that question…
Question #13 : Any plans or interest in letting people use their Z2O as collateral? I'm guessing that'll be the borrow feature, is there an ETA on that?
(asked by Sharkii)
i think we addressed this question about the lending protocol a bit earlier actually. There's no clear ETA but obviously if you want to try and respect it?
Uh yeah, so wrapped Steaked Z2O will very likely be a collateral option on the landing protocol. Currently the smart contracts are for the lending and borrowing features are in testing. We have made changes to the original lending fork that we plan to make, that I described earlier and will be available in the recording or transcription of this AMA.
So now we're testing them and then once we finish that we have a work in progress front end, and we'll hopefully be rolling it out maybe a week from now, maybe slightly less / maybe slightly more.
Hm-Hmph, dropping the alpha. Thank you Puffin, I just noticed we are hitting our hour mark, so we will be wrapping up here. We do not want to take too much of everyone's time.
Let's see, does anyone want to take up closing remarks or any final questions.
I do want to say just from my perspective again - we do have from my perspective a unique long-term vision for this project. ZeroTwOhm is what a lot of people came to us for, but ZeroTwOhm will grow and will continue to become like a bigger project.
It's not the only thing that we're working on so for everyone that's sticking with us and believing on the team we really appreciate you and yeah we won't let you down.
We'll work our hardest and continue to try and build grow more value for everyone here.
Cool, anyone else finishing remarks. Foks did you want to speak a little ?
[Chuckles] Yeah maybe we can say we are very bullish on Arbitrum. But we are also actively looking at other shit we can do on other chains, and we're pretty excited about the future of Arbitrum itself of course but also other chains.
Mostly what we're excited about is how dope our team is - uh we've been expanding quite a bit. We have the OG team like Puffin and Luffy, PickACard, CptAuJus. Then I joined recently and a lot of people joined recently and it's been really great working with these folks and the reason I joined in the first place was because of the community.
I've been in this discord for quite a bit and the community here is like genuinely unparalleled it reminds me a lot of how Ohm’s discord was in the beginning.
So yeah shout out to the team, shout out to the community.